Episode 703: What Practices Need to Know Right Now

 Kiera is joined by Josey Sewell, partner at Dentist Entrepreneur Organization (DEO), to talk about how dental practices can recession-proof their practices right now. Josey touches on what leaders need to do first and foremost, predicts what the working model will look like over the next couple of years, and gives tips for keeping your culture healthy.

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Transcript:

[music]

0:00:05.8 Kiera Dent: Hey everyone, welcome to the Dental A Team podcast. I'm your host Kiera Dent. And I have this crazy idea that maybe I could combine a doctor and a team member's perspective. Because let's face it, dentistry can be a challenging profession with those two perspectives. I've been a dental assistant treatment coordinator, scheduler, pillar, office manager, regional manager, practice owner, and I have a team of traveling consultants where we have traveled to over 165 different offices, coaching teams. Yep. We don't just understand you, we are you. Our mission is to positively impact the world of dental. And I believe that this podcast is the greatest way I can help elevate teams grow VIP experiences, reduce stress, and create A teams. Welcome to the Dental A Team podcast. Hello Dental A Team listeners, this is Kiera and you guys, today I get to bring on an incredible guest for you guys. She's someone that I definitely have an obsession with their company. Like I have followed this company so much. They've branded it, they've named it so well, DEO. If you guys haven't heard of DEO, it's the Dentist Entrepreneur Organization.

0:01:09.2 KD: Guys, I geek out on all things entrepreneurial and I've got the amazing Josey Sewell, like cool, that's how you're gonna remember her. And she is a partner at the Dentist Entrepreneur Organization and the co-founder of the DEO MAP. So guys, we are in for a solid treat. We're gonna go through like great recession culture and who knows what else. Me and Rachel Hollis look alike, like Girl, Wash Your Face, is who she is. Josey, welcome to the show today.

0:01:34.3 Josey Sewell: Kiera, thank you so much. I love your energy and your passion and what you do. So it is such an honor to be with you today.

0:01:40.6 KD: Yeah, it's so fun and I'm so glad. An office told me, they're like, Kiera, could you like tone down the coffee before 6:00 AM? And I'm like, guys, I don't even drink coffee. Like this is just who I spring out of bed. Can you imagine my husband's life? So, people who love the passion, love it, and those who don't, Hey, it's fine guys, I get it. I see you too. So, Josey, I gave a little bit of a background on you. Guys, she literally looks like Rachel Hollis. I was obsessed with Rachel Hollis with Girl, Wash Your Face, and Josey came on, I'm like, you are like a Rachel Hollis at the beginning lookalike. So Josey, beyond being, Rachel Hollis 's doppelganger out there, tell us a little more about you and DEO and all the great things you guys are up to.

0:02:19.1 JS: Yeah, absolutely. So I'm a hygienist by training and loved clinical. However, clinical was a little bit repetitive for my personality. So I started exploring other options. I taught at a hygiene school for a little bit. I did some speaking and writing, but found myself moving from New Mexico where my husband and I grew up. We moved to the Pacific Northwest. That's when I really got into coaching and consulting and found my love and passion for the business of dentistry. From there I moved from Washington state to North Carolina to grow a dental group. I was an executive on that team. So while I was there, my first seat was as the director of hygiene. Then I moved to the director of culture or people, like there's a lot of cultural and personal development, professional development for our teams, director of operations and then was the COO when we sold it to a larger DSO. After that, I worked at Dental Intel for a short time, pandemic hit, I decided like, hey, when the rest of the world is in chaos, why not just quit a very stable, very great job and start your own business? So the call to entrepreneurship was strong for me. I started my own coaching business in the middle of COVID.

0:03:32.0 JS: I was actually doing EOS implementation with dental companies and was a certified EOS implementer. Then EOS went to a franchise, decided not to stick around for the franchise 'cause it was gonna limit my ability to be super specific with dental. So my business partner, Dr. Eric Roman and I, we had built two brands. We merged them with the DEO, the Dentist Entrepreneur Organization. And since joining what we've done is we've built a business operating system specific for dentistry. So getting your vision really clear, getting your team aligned culture systems process, with the ultimate goal of building a self-managing company. So within the DEO, it is really for that entrepreneurial dentist who has a desire to grow. We have industry events, we've got an amazing summit coming up and then we have a couple of different programs where we teach our program, which we call DEO MAP. And MAP is our dental operating system.

0:04:27.7 KD: Very cool. And I feel like, Josey, your company and our company are very synergistic in the fact that you guys help with a lot of the structure, the foundation and we come in and put the systems into play, get your team on board with a lot of these things. So it's real fun guys. Which is why I wanted Josey to come on. And I do love the entrepreneurial spirit within you. I also love that you're an EOS lover. I did it for the exact same thing. I was like, Mm-hmm, franchise. We're gonna make Dental A Team's version of this, Gino, Mike Paton and I actually coached for a hot minute and then he was like, Kiera, you gotta franchise all your coaches. And I'm like, tell me no more. I'm gonna make this up. Like I'm obsessed with traction and EOS and definitely love the implementation piece of it. However, give a little spin, give a little twist, which is what I think you guys do a lot of. So I am curious, Josey, with all that background and all the pieces that you work on with culture, I feel like right now we had this, like I've been kind of watching trends, right? We have COVID in 2020, then we have the great resignation, then we have the quiet quitting, and now I feel like we're falling into this like recession, like there's buzzes around it. What's it gonna look like? How's it gonna be?

0:05:33.1 KD: So I'm curious like as we're watching these trends, what are some of the things you guys are seeing that you're preparing, that you're prepping for of how to truly recession proof your practice? 'Cause I'm obsessed with this topic right now. And I also love like looking 40 feet down the line and figuring out, what do we need to do to prepare now so that way we are not caught in the midst of it and not realize it?

0:05:53.9 JS: Yeah, absolutely. So I think that as we have seen all of this, the great resignation and then we kind of turned it like the great regret, right? 'Cause everybody quit their job for a couple more dollars an hour and then found that maybe they were working for a place that they didn't love. The grass wasn't greener on the other side. But the recession has been really interesting. A lot of people would argue that dentistry is recession proof. And I don't necessarily know if that's the case because across what I'm seeing, we have seen a decrease in production or revenue really beginning like Q3, Q4. So many of the clients that I work with, they did not have as great of a 2022 as what 2021 was. 2021 was like this unicorn year. We had all these backed up patients, they had some government support with loans and things like that. There was almost this like false sense of continued growth. And then with the employment market with wage inflation, I mean, people got hit hard in 2022. And so some of the things that we focused on, I think I saw you guys did like a whole recession series, which I was super excited. I love to see what everybody else is doing. We also did a recession series and so I love what you guys do where you go to the practice, you get down on the ground, you're really building it with them.

0:07:08.0 JS: We really support offices that are like 1.5 million in one location to a hundred locations and a hundred million. So we have this wide breadth. So we try really hard to think in like framework or principles and so that people can customize it to what they're doing. So within the recession, one of the things that we talked about is, number one, if you are a leader or an owner, you have to, number one, protect your confidence. And what I mean by that is, taking care of yourself physically, mentally, and spiritually. So if you are not sleeping well, you're not eating well, you're not exercising, you're not in a great place to make good decisions or deal with uncertainty or even with your team. So part of what we talked about was, first take care of yourself. The second thing was, how do I communicate with my team? And I think that a lot of people feel like vulnerability is a weakness, but vulnerability I really feel like is a strength. And so, how can you be open and transparent with your team in a way that shows them the reality of what's happening in the world, but not induce like a ton of fear and panic?

0:08:16.0 JS: Obviously everybody's trying to, what I see happening a lot this year is maybe we're seeing a decrease in the number of de Novos or startups and acquisitions where people are buying it. But what people are really focusing on is internal growth. So how can I get really, really clear with my finances and how can I really optimize my operations so that we're maximizing every patient interaction and doing more with less? And then, obviously, like mitigating risk, understanding flexible staffing models and really learning how to engage your team. So those are kind of high level, some of the things that we're talking about with the recession.

0:08:54.1 KD: I love it. And I think it's, just some fun things. I mean, guys, we have no idea what's gonna happen. So I agree. I really feel that you've gotta have that strong mindset because I think that that's gonna navigate, be your best compass through all of this is being strong and like you said, being transparent with your team. I am curious what you guys are seeing and just kinda your thoughts, especially where you have a lot of team, you've built up a lot of cultures. What's your prediction, Josey? And again, you don't have a crystal ball either. This is us rifting because we don't know what's gonna happen. Do you think moving forward it's going to be more of this like different working model in practices? Or do you think we'll revert back to what was normal where it's like 40 hour work weeks? Or do you think it'll be this more? I feel like it's a weird model right now where it's this hybrid, but yeah, we also are Dental A offices so we can't really have this hybrid, but I'm noticing more and more and more part-time positions being filled. What's kinda your prediction of what the working model will look like over this next year, two years? How do you think that that's gonna transition?

0:10:00.3 JS: If I could accurately predict, I wouldn't have to work anymore because that would mean that would be great.

[laughter]

0:10:03.8 KD: Amen. Right?

0:10:07.8 JS: But I think that sometimes there's like this pushback or this energy that's like, oh, I just want this to go away and I want it to go back to normal. And I don't know that we ever returned to what we thought was normal. I absolutely think that we start to see more flexible models. And so for example, yesterday I was on a call with a dentist and he was really struggling to recruit hygienists. And so we've seen a lot of hygienists move to temporary work instead of being committed to an office. Part of the reason that they like that is just the flexibility in saying I can or I can't work today. And so I'm seeing dentists get really, really creative to say, okay, fine, how can I have flexible options inside but have my own hygienist? Because it's really tough for dentists to work with temporary hygienists because they don't know your standard of care, they don't know your office. Well, many dentists feel like maybe they don't take as great care of their patients as if they were a team member or they really struggled to provide like some coaching or ways for them to align. So I think that we're absolutely going to see some more flexible, options for hygienists or even associate dentists, I think that we have to. I also see that many people are trying to use technology or remote [0:11:25.9] ____.

0:11:26.0 KD: I'm like a total jerk. I'm like a total jerk right now. I'm just gonna interrupt. Yeah, 'cause I'm curious like, what does that flexibility look like? I like to be real tactical, so I'm sure someone listening is like, okay, that's a great idea, but like they're a producer. How on earth do I provide this flexible work schedule when I've got hygiene patients booked out six months? What does that actually look like?

0:11:45.9 JS: I don't have a great answer for that because honestly, people are just kind of dabbling their toes and I'd be interested in six months how some of them come back and report. But I think some of them are just like, fine, how can I have my own temps? Right? Like maybe they still get to kind of pick and choose when they're working or if I've got four or five of 'em and I have three spots for a hygienist, can I at least get some of those things covered? So I don't have great answers. I feel like something has to change, but I don't, again, I wish I was like, oh, here's the template and if you do this, it's going to work.

0:12:21.7 KD: No, I love it, and I'm so glad that you said you don't know, but I think what I love is, it's a different way of thinking, guys. And that's what I love about this conversation is, how can we think differently? How can we be 20 steps ahead? Because we've thought through like, okay, why are people working there? And I think like, Josey, you did a really great job of asking the question of like, why are these hygienists wanting temporary work? Well, they want it for the flexibility of, I can work today, I don't have to work today. And then how could you get creative within your practice to accommodate that need? Maybe it say, you guys have flex days, so maybe it say, work three days and then there's a flex day, that's the fourth day. So if they need to get more hygiene or they need to get their SRP patients in there, there is a flex day available to them. But that means they're only working three full days, one flex day. If they need to get patients in, they're hitting their numbers and maybe they can rotate that way. So Josey, I'm so glad you said that. I didn't mean to put you on the spot, but I'm like, I wanna get tactical. I wanna like, how can we implement this? And I think the answer is, guys, you gotta get savvy, you gotta get creative. But I think like just ask the better questions of, why are they doing this? What are the trends? What is the need that this is fulfilling and how can you do that internally?

0:13:31.1 JS: Yes, absolutely. And I think the other thing is, dentists were kind of complaining that hygienists were leaving or not wanting to come back to work, and I had a dentist say, it just makes it really hard for me to trust hygienists anymore. And I was like, well, like I'd like to challenge you there. I dunno if that's totally fair for every hygienist. Because on the opposite side, when these team members did have an option, especially during COVID when they were off a little bit, everybody really challenged themselves, I think they asked themselves, where do I wanna be spending my time? Am I truly happy? And, am I fulfilled? And so some of this great resignation or even this quiet quitting when we wanna say, oh, these people are lazy or they don't wanna come to work. I don't think that that's actually the case. I think quiet quitting is this call out that we have got to be better leaders. We have to provide a psychologically safe environment for our team. We have to connect with our people in meaningful ways. We have to measure their performance appropriately and we have to coach them, right? People don't wanna be managed, people wanna be coached.

0:14:33.9 JS: So I think that the way that we engage and lead our team in the past, dentistry's just been really easy that we had to do the minimum stuff and we didn't have to be a great leader. And it all worked out okay because we had plenty of team members. Now what we're seeing is, if you really wanna win the game, you really need to learn how to lead and manage people and provide a great environment for them to go to work.

0:14:56.7 KD: Yeah. And on that same vein, Josey, what are some of the things that you would say would be, I don't know, I feel like there's like ranges of leadership, right? Like there's like this extreme elite like amazing practice and then there's like, it's like the old way, nothing's really changed and then there's like this middle road. What are some of the characteristics you're seeing or cultures that we're able to put into play that might make us go from like just not even on the board to middle and then from that middle to great? 'Cause based on where these practices are, I really do think there's a great gradient system there. What are some of those things that they could implement to make them move from one tier to the next?

0:15:34.7 JS: Yeah, that's a really great question. First of all, you don't have to be anybody, like you don't have to be somebody else to be a great leader. Sometimes we look at these very charismatic, well-spoken people and we believe if we're an introvert or we're a little more quiet or we struggle with communication, that we have to change who we are. That's really not the case. So I first wanna say that no matter who you are or what your personality type is, you can be a great leader. I think that in general, in dentistry, we're very systematic, right? And it's like, hey, if I'm gonna do a crown, I follow these five steps. And so what's been missing is, dental leaders in particular need a good system to rely on in order to become a great leader. And so we've just never been taught that. And that's one of the things we've tried to solve is like how to create a systematic way. If you follow these things then you can be a great leader. So for us, again, we refer to it as connect measure and coach. And so we do things like, we don't do annual performance reviews, we actually do a quarterly check-in. And during that quarterly check-in, again, we connect with our team members to find out how are they doing, how are they feeling, how's life going for them?

0:16:44.2 JS: Measure their performance, meaning, are they aligned to the core values? Are they aligned to the vision? And then looking at their key performance indicators over the last 13 weeks, right? 'Cause it's once a quarter and in coaching them. And so when I say coaching them, it's working in partnership with those team members to set goals for their own career, and learn or grow in a way that they desire to grow that benefits and helps them achieve mastery over time. So anyway, I would say, if you're not having regular conversations with your team, start having those conversations. At least a pretty structured conversation once a quarter. Something that we think is super valuable is in these quarterly check-ins, it's not just, if Kiera, I'm your manager, it's not just like how I feel like your performance or how you're doing, but it's also how am I doing as a manager? Am I providing a safe and healthy work environment for you? What do you want more of? What do you want less of? And and then how can we work through that together? So the change, like manage, our world has changed dramatically in the last 30-40 years, but the practice of management hasn't. And so we have to change that and modernize that and that's because people feel very differently about work than they did decades ago.

0:18:01.8 KD: I really love that and I like thinking in the future, guys, I like seeing where are we headed, what are the trends and how can I be that forward thinking practice rather than being stuck in my ways. Now, that doesn't always come easy. I think sometimes it's very hard to admit that I need to change, but I really love that you guys have it more as a dynamic group as opposed to, I'm managing, it's like a top down approach compared to a peer to peer. And I think it's really helpful, 'cause as a manager I'm like, I don't even know if these people like what am I doing well? What am I not? And I didn't feel like I ever got that feedback unless it was negative on exit interviews of like you didn't do this, this, this. And as a manager that can be very hard. And so I think it's also normalizing and supporting managers as well to where you are getting that feedback. What am I doing well, how can I support you more? What can I do less of? And I think my biggest piece in all that is, I feel like it's helping teams have more trust, more open communication, which then minimizes this quiet quitting, minimizes this great resignation, because teams, when you feel safe and you feel happy and you feel supported. Like I just heard a quote the other day and they said, people don't quit companies, they quit managers.

0:19:15.0 JS: Yes.

0:19:15.5 KD: And I really thought that was interesting, and I'm like, it's true because they can love their doctor but if their manager's not supporting them or their doctor if they're managing them isn't supporting them, that's why they're quitting. And so being able to think ahead and look to see what could you do to change, I think is really magical. Are there any last, like if you were giving out your greatest tip to dental practices right now, or dental office managers, like what do you feel the dental industry needs to hear right now that you wanna put a nice like bow on our podcast today?

0:21:52.9 JS: Great ending question. And so I would say, our number one principle is that we have one life space. And so what that means is, I can't separate who Josey is as a person, who Josey is as a professional. And so we have to get rid of this old mindset that you leave your crap at the door and we need to recognize that people are whole human beings and that they come with all sorts of life experience and we have to meet people where they are. And when we truly learn to love people, our people are the greatest line item on our P&L, right? And yet it's the place where you put the least amount of time and effort learning how to support and manage them. And so learning to love your people and really engaging in your culture will really help you. Whether it's a recession or COVID or competition or anything else, when you have a healthy team, you will survive whatever comes your way.

0:22:41.8 KD: Beautiful, Josey. I love that, guys. It really is true. I think like seeing them as an asset, not a problem, like not a liability. Team members, I just think it changes your whole focus. And I think that was really beautifully said, especially right now where it's like, what do I focus on? What do I do? I think so many people are stressed and it's like, have a great mindset and love your team. That's it. Like that's really it. So Josey, thank you so much. I appreciate your time. I appreciate your love for what you we do in this dentistry profession together. I just appreciate you today being on the podcast and sharing so much valuable knowledge.

0:23:14.3 JS: Thanks for having me. It was wonderful.

0:23:16.8 KD: Of course. All right guys, go sign those tickets, like she said, DEO250, it'll be a good time, guys. Go meet fellow listeners. Josey, it was a killer time today. Thank you so much. And for all of you listening, thanks for listening, and I'll catch you next time on the Dental A Team podcast. And that wraps it up for another episode of the Dental A Team podcast. Thank you so much for listening and we'll talk to you next time.